a new understanding of today, time and space.

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Re: a new understanding of today, time and space.

Postby Peter Kropotkin » Tue May 19, 2020 12:01 am

we exist in a world with ism's and ideologies...…

we are born into a world with ism's and ideologies
and we are then indoctrinated into these ism's and ideologies...

so far, so good...…. and because most people fail to
hold to the principle of knowing themselves
and doing an reexamination of values, most "people"
hold to the values and ism's that they were indoctrinated with....

in America, we are indoctrinated with the value that "America" is
the greatest country on earth... we are indoctrinated with
"nationalism" as a value...from my dictionary:

Nationalism patriotic feeling, principles, or efforts.

an extreme form of this, especially marked by a feeling of
superiority over other countries.

advocacy of political independence for a particular country.....

We in America hold to the second definition: an extreme form of
feeling of superiority over other counties.....

Nationalism in America is overlaid with prejudice and superstitions
and biases.... nationalism is held by those who believe in the
superiority of the white race... hatred of others is a prime example
of this nationalism...hatred of Jews, blacks, women, liberals, to be specific...…
at least in America...…if you are different from me, you are the other...
US vs THEM..... I have rejected this viewpoint for a wide variety of reasons....

however to be clear, we must reject nationalism for another reason.....

nationalism is a battle that was fought a long time ago....

in other words... nationalism as an ideology was for another
time, another environment... it was an answer that was right
and appropriate for another time and place...

but our environment today isn't about nationalism....
we are in a post-nationalistic environment....

nationalism was an answer to a question a long time ago....

it no longer answer our questions....it no longer fits into
our environment....nationalism is fighting a war that was long ago won....

"tale of an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing"

and lost in that sound and fury is the real question of our time.....

how do we fit into the state? as individuals, how do we fit
into our current state? how do we fit into our society?

state and society, for now, we shall take as separate entities....

I am an individual.... I hold certain values and rights...
how do I fit into a society that may or may not accept those
values and rights?

how do I fit into a state, our modern police state, that is determined to
measure me and time me and hold me accountable but not to hold
the state just as accountable.... we have a double standard in America
today.... the middle and working poor are held to one standard and
the wealthy and powerful are held to another standard
and the state to an entirely different standard...…

if I am to be held accountable, and I have no problem with that,
then everyone must be held accountable with the same relentless
quest....and we can clearly see the question of accountability being
of two different standards in America...…

how can I fit into a society that hold me accountable and doesn't hold
others accountable for the same actions?

we have justice denied which means we don't have justice at all.....

and that is a big problem in America today...…

and how do I fit, as an individual within that injustice?

how do I begin the process of holding people to justice,
as I am being held to justice?

as noted before, justice is the exact same thing as equality...…
to hear one word, justice is to hear another word, equality....

so how do I fit into a country, as an individual that doesn't practice
equality.. given that equality is the basic principle of our country....

"we hold these truths to be self evident, that all men are created equal"

"man is born free and yet, everywhere he is in chains"

if I am born free and equal, how did time make me unequal?

by what principles have I become unequal? and thus can be
treated unfairly, unjustly?

justice/equality cannot be defined by wealth or titles or fame
or position...… no, justice must be justice regardless of wealth,
title, fame or position...….and so, how do I fall into a category
that allows me to be treated without equality?

the question, the modern question is one where,
we try to understand how we fit into society, where we can
still be individuals and yet, meet this question of being a part
of society...…

if by principles, I become alienated from society, why must
the society principles become the only value that is accepted...….
why am I discounted from society because I hold different values
then the society holds to?

how do individuals fit into society?

and how do we understand that relationship between society
and individuals?

Ibsen and Kierkegaard both thought the "crowd was untruth" but
that just isn't so... the individual as well as the crowd
can hold to untruth.... but how do we understand this "untruth"?

by what measurement can we measure "untruth"?

what do we mean by "untruth"? and what can we do to return us
to the "truth"?

if I hold to my "truths" and that no longer allows me to belong
to the "crowd" then who is right, the crowd or me?

if I am alienated from society because of the values I hold,
then who must change, society or me?

so what is the relationship between individuals and society/state?

Kropotkin
"Those who sacrifice liberty for security
wind up with neither."
"Ben Franklin"
Peter Kropotkin
ILP Legend
 
Posts: 7835
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Re: a new understanding of today, time and space.

Postby Peter Kropotkin » Thu May 21, 2020 12:09 am

in the midst of working several days in a row.....

I have been accused of being a "communist" …..

but what am I actually attempting to do?

am I attempting to change society to fit or match some rational
ideals?

No, not at all.....I do think society should be changed, but
how, how we change it makes all the difference in the world....

the American revolution succeeded whereas the French and
Russian revolution failed. But why did the one succeed and
the other two fail?

and given the fact those two failed, it would also suggest
that any attempt to radically change society will also fail....
but once again, why?

the American revolution wasn't about changing society...
the structure of American society remained the same for a long
time after 1776....

and if you look at both the French and Russian revolution, the change
was in large part structural.... the changing of the institutions that
people lived under....society dramatically changed in the 10 years
from the end of the respective revolution, French and Russian....

but the American society didn't radically change after the revolution....

it was a political revolution that America created...

the French and Russian revolution tried to radically change
the institutions and method of people's lives after the revolution.....

the 10 years after the French revolution, France was a completely
different country..by 1799....

and think of Russia after the revolution... so 1928.....
Russia was a completely changed country after the revolution....

but America was not completely changed after their revolution.....

life pretty much went on as it had the years before
the revolution...

one could argue, that the America we know, didn't come into being until
after the war of 1812....

but given all this, I don't believe that revolution is the way to go until,
and this word until is very important.... until their is a change in the mind
and heart of people...…. if we don't have an understanding of what being human is
and if we aren't able to make sense of what our goal is, we cannot conduct any
type of revolution...…. the true beginning of any, any revolution begins in the
minds and heart of the people.....

the true revolution begins once we engage in Socrates two sayings....

"to know thyself"

"the unexamined life isn't worth living"

the revolution of the state, society, culture, can only come after, after
we have engaged in our reevaluations of values....

the first step toward a reorganization of society begins with a
reorganization of the mind/heart...…

the making of a better society beings with one person engaging
in a reevaluation of values.....

one might proclaim: the world sucks.... and it will continue to
suck until you, yes you engage in some sort of examination
of yourself that allows you to be clear on what it means to
be human and what is the goal/point of being human...…
and what values are the values we are going to live by...…

until we get individually right, we cannot get society right.....

so when I say the revolution is to become who you are,
I mean that literally.... to reorganize the world, we have
to have an engagement with who we are and what it means to be us.....

and I can hear the negative ones, shouting, but Kropotkin,
I am right, it is all those other fools who are fucking it up.....

every battle, every revolution, every war begins with one person..
and their engagement with who they are.....

you want peace in the land.... begin with finding peace within
you.... what values are really your values?

you can't control the others, the "fools", but you can control you
and your engagement with who you are.....that is all you can control.....
and that is how we find peace and love and harmony in the land.....

one person at a time.... until there is a overwhelming mass that
will suddenly become one.....

the cliché that is true, is the cliché that says: be the change you want....

and it all begins with an engagement with yourself....
and who you are.....and what your values are...…

the path, the journey to change the world is actually
an easy path/journey...……. just become.. go from being to becoming....

and what should I become? that is the question...….

to know what to become, you have to know who you are...
to know thyself...……and then engage in a reevaluation of values.....

the road, the path to a new society, a new state, a utopia... begins
with you and an examination of who you are.....

Kropotkin
"Those who sacrifice liberty for security
wind up with neither."
"Ben Franklin"
Peter Kropotkin
ILP Legend
 
Posts: 7835
Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2005 1:47 am
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Re: a new understanding of today, time and space.

Postby Peter Kropotkin » Wed May 27, 2020 1:36 am

after several brutal days of work, I'm finally back...…

I still have two more days of shit ahead of me... but what can you do?

as I am making this up as I go along, hang with me...…

the question, perhaps the ultimate political and social question
is, what is the relationship between the individual and the society/state?

we see clowns walking around today without their mask, saying their
"rights" outweigh my right to being protected from the virus...…..

what height of stupidity are they reaching for?

but this brings to mind this question of the relationship between
the individual and the society/state?

perhaps we should start even more basic. Perhaps we should start
with the principles of philosophy.....

for example, the Greeks thought the goal of life was to reach
"Arete".... which is excellence... everyone should attempt to
reach their excellence.. and this was the driving goal of Greek
society for centuries.....

The Chinese thought the goal was the "Dao" which is sometimes
thought of as a path, a guide, conduct or direction.....

Follow the path of Dao and that lead to success, both individually
and collectively....Dao was thought of as an ethical/moral way...…
the way to behave in society.....

you hear another Chinese thought, which is harmony...

how do we achieve harmony, both as an individual and collectively.....

we have another Chinese word, Ren... which can be translated as
humanity or benevolence.....which is the Confucian virtue denoting the
good quality of a virtuous human when being altruistic. Ren can be thought
of as a normal adult's protective feeling for children...…

it is considered one of the means for a "good" king or leader to rule....

to achieve Ren, is the goal of a moral leader...…

now each of these thoughts are not specific actions by themselves....

they are consider ideals or concepts in which people attempt to reach
to become moral people...…

Perhaps we could rethink ethics and morality into terms similar
to Ren or harmony or arete or the Dao?

dinner is served, will write later.....

and an excellent dinner it was.....

as noted in an earlier post: there is no such thing as individual ethics,
ethics can only exists within the confines of a group, city, polis, family,
state or civilization......ethics.. morality is based on a collective basis,
not an individual basis.....

so in regards to ethics/morality, what is the relationship between
the individual and the society/state?

and another question: what is of greater value? the individual
engagement with their soul or the laws and institutions that we
know quite well here in America and the western world?

if one makes the argument that the society is ill and sick, what
are possible cures, more laws, more legislation, stricter adherence
to the legal and bureaucracies of the state or more engagement
with getting people to uphold the laws themselves?

and that is done by getting people to take the path of harmony
or Dao or Arete or Ren...…….

you also have this question of science, of entropy.....
everything is about entropy... which is the natural decay
everything piece of matter within the universe.... everything
is in process and that process is going from order to disorder...

the final stage of entropy in a human being is by so much
disorder occurs that the body no longer functions and death occurs....

every question of morality and ethics must take into account
entropy and the movement, path of matter to go into decay/disorder.....

as harmony and Dao and Ren bring energy into people and institutions,
the opposite of entropy..... so, we can see how if we follow
a method, a path such as harmony or Dao, we can achieve
balance and keeping the equation equal....as I have argued for.....
and this balance/harmony allows for the path of humans and
institutions and all things human, kept into balance which means
entropy cannot enter the equation....

the inflow of energy must equal the outflow of energy...….

keeping to the path or methods of the Chinese or the Greeks, Arete,
we can keep the equation equal, energy = loss of energy.... the two must balance....

and I have defined equality as justice.... the two are equal....
to have justice, we must treat everyone as equal...…..

think of money as energy..... we must hold money in balance as we do
with energy...… to hold the equation.....

too much money on one side of the equation sends the equation out of balance.....

we have income inequality and that sends the balance of our equation out of control.....

the equation of existence requires that we have just as much coming in as we
have going out.... this is true of the body, this is true of justice, this is true
entropy and disorder, to hold balance means we must have equality of
going in as we do going out...……..

being poor in America means you have less coming in then going out...

and that imbalance, disrupts and disturbs people....

if some/few are super wealthy, then most people are without wealth....
there is only so much wealth to go around...…

the equation is off and by being off, we have entropy... more energy
going out then coming in...….

and all of this, is one, this is not a few separate thoughts,
but one thought about several different aspects of the same thing.....

ethics, morality, income inequality, justice, entropy, the equations of life,
energy, matter, the way, Arete, Dao, they are not distinct and
separate entities.... they are different aspects of the same idea....

human existence is a path, a journey... but where are we going to?

what is our destination?

we can have the same destination and still have different ways of
achieving those goals..... some take their time when traveling
and some speed march when traveling and some take different approaches....

the path/journey is find our own path to the collective goal we have...….

I can bring in more energy into society and thus fight entropy...

I can find my own journey into bringing energy into the systems
we have....we don't have to have the exact same method of bringing
energy into the system thus equalizing it... keeping the equation.....

that is the path.... how do we prevent entropy death of our society/ state/
civilization? many different possibilities exists.... and we can mix and match
our findings.....

ethics and morality is just another path, method of keeping energy into
the system.. preventing entropy.....

so in the end, we find our ultimate goal... preventing entropy from
destroying our society/state/ civilization. that is the goal....
how do we achieve it?

Kropotkin
"Those who sacrifice liberty for security
wind up with neither."
"Ben Franklin"
Peter Kropotkin
ILP Legend
 
Posts: 7835
Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2005 1:47 am
Location: blue state

Re: a new understanding of today, time and space.

Postby Peter Kropotkin » Wed May 27, 2020 3:41 pm

so as noted above, we have vastly different possibilities as to
how to achieve our goals...….

we have methods like Dao and Ren and Harmony.....

we have philosophies like Stoicism and existentialism and
positivism, analytic philosophy and poststructuralism....for example....

and we have specific philosophers we can follow like Kant, Spinoza
and Nietzsche....

we have ism's and ideologies like capitalism and communism and
Catholicism....

and we have religions like Catholicism and Buddhism and
Islam.....

pause for a second...

and back.....

so we have the Kantian/Kropotkin questions of existence....

what am I to do? what should I believe in? what can I know?
what should my values be? to what should I put my energy into?

and the above list offers us possibilities...….

so, I ask myself, what should I believe in?
and the above list will offer me answers....

I can believe in Catholicism or I can believe in philosophy
or I can believe in capitalism...….the list is practically
endless....every single ism and ideology is a possibility for
us to believe in.....

the question, what am I to do? also has endless possibilities....
I can spend my life engaging in religion or philosophy
or engaging in capitalism or eat, drink and be merry for
tomorrow I die.....

the problem comes with the fact that people really don't make
a choice....they simply fall into some indoctrination of their
youth and without any conscience choice, they simply follow
those notions we were indoctrinated with as children.....

and that is what I am fighting against.... the idea that we must,
must simply engage with what we were indoctrinated with...
with no choice given..... you have a choice... you simple
won't engage with your choices.....

maybe what you are to do is engage with Buddhism or
perhaps with religion or perhaps with the way, the path of Dao....

people simply rush into their life without making any choices.....

they allow their childhood indoctrinations to guide them....

and why?

because they didn't have the courage of an reevaluation of values that
told them what they really and truly believed in... and not just
the stuff we were indoctrinated with....

I was indoctrinated with the idea that America is the greatest country
on earth... but we have failed that concept because
as any athlete will tell you, you are always working hard,
very hard to maintain that level of excellence.... sports titles
are won every years and every year, you have to work harder
and harder to maintain that level of excellence....

and what does that have to do with America the Great?

because we don't, won't work every single day to hold
on to our excellence... a goal once achieved must be
worked on every single day to maintain... we refuse to
work on our excellence every single day and thus we
are no longer the greatest country on earth....

titles like that have to be worked for and we simply live
off the title that was achieved by those in the past,
not by us.... until we achieve excellence every single day,
we are not the greatest country on earth.....

so what ism or ideology will help us achieve our goals?

depends upon the goal, now doesn't it?

now personally, I am not going to be defined by the supposed
greatness of America, I am going to be defined by who I am
and what I am reaching for.....

you woke up today.. and what was your goal for the day?

to simply be alive in the evening?

that is aiming very, very, very low...…

why not attempt to reach for the stars and attempt
the impossible.....

when history or philosophy books are written, I want
to be listed as one of the best philosophers who ever lived.....

I want to be listed as equal to Kant or to Spinoza or to Nietzsche.....

so I work every single day to achieve that goal....

and I work hard... every off hour I can spend, I spend it thinking
or writing or reading....I want to achieve excellence in being
a philosopher.....

that in part, what drives me to engage in the way I do...…

a day not spent in philosophy is a wasted day.....
and lately because of work, I have wasted a lot of days recently....

so in the above list, I am engaging in philosophy,
not in ism like communism or Catholicism....
and I am not engaged in Dao or Ren or Arete
or any of the hundreds of possibilities that we call
isms and ideologies in which we can engage with as human beings....

and what of the other Kantian/Kropotkin questions like
what shall I believe in or what shall I spend my energy on?

we can search the above list and then apply energy into
our chosen picks... be it a ism or ideology or religion or
philosophy or being in the Dao or Ren.....

the list is almost to big and so we fall back into the
safe, known of our indoctrinations..... and thus we
miss an opportunity, a chance to become who we are.....

I am not saying pick this path or this road, I am saying
make a choice.. be who you are....don't let your indoctrinations
decide for you, who you are...…

we can be in the Dao or be a catholic or be an existentialist
or engage in communism or capitalism or Buddhism.....

the point is to make a conscience decision to become who you are.....

and that will only happen with some hard and sometimes
unhappy decisions.... but make it happen instead of letting it
happen to you.....be the change you want to be.....

Kropotkin
"Those who sacrifice liberty for security
wind up with neither."
"Ben Franklin"
Peter Kropotkin
ILP Legend
 
Posts: 7835
Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2005 1:47 am
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Re: a new understanding of today, time and space.

Postby Peter Kropotkin » Fri May 29, 2020 6:18 pm

survived... I worked 9 days with only 1 day off in between and
that off day, I spent on the couch sleeping from exhaustion....

so we have two possibilities... one possibility is that we find
our meaning, point, reason for existence within us and the other
possibility is we find meaning outside of us.....

we discover who we are and what we can become....
going from being to becoming....as an internal discovery.....

the other possibility lies with the external goals... our engagement
with ism's is one possibility.... being a good conservative is one such choice...
or being an anarchist or being Catholic or being Buddhist or a communist....

you find meaning and purpose in some assigned goal....which
is found in following an ism or an ideology.....

it is not an either or situation..... you can be a good Catholic and still
engage in your inner possibilities...the highest role model that existed
in America, for decades, was that of citizen.... being a good citizen
was considered to be the height of what it meant to be human....

America first....be a patriot... America is number one...…

jingoism at its best...…

and IQ45 and his ilk still hold to the superiority of America over all other...

look at how IQ45 has called Mexicans, bad hombres and subhuman....

the negation of others who are not Americans....US vs Them.....

you see this played out every day in America....

the white woman who called the police on black man in NY..
the other day... she lied to the police about him threating her...
she was trying to weaponize the police against a black man....
and why? because he was not "US" in being white....

this is what happens when you create an US vs Them attitude.....

to be a "good" citizen means to negate others who aren't America citizens....

to hold "White Privilege" is an US vs Them.....

but is that really the path, the way to our engagement with the world?

and tell me, how does this make us better, as human beings?

Holding to being a good citizen or holding to "White privilege"?

what is really called for is an reevaluation of what it means to be human....

to begin the external or internal examination of what route to take,
requires, demands us to understand our starting point...…

every decision we make to be good citizens or to hold to being
Catholic or to be communist or to be capitalist, requires us
to begin at the start and understand what we are, right from the start...…

I am Kropotkin.... and what do I believe in? I am a social creature,
I must, for both my mental and physical health, engage with other
human beings....that is the start of what it means to be human....

as we discovered during our self isolation, that we cannot, cannot
engage in true self isolation..... for we are then denied what it means
to be human, truly human.....contact with other human beings is essential
to what it means to be human.....

so the Kantian/Kropotkin questions, what am I to do? what should I
believe in? what can I know? are really questions like this.....

what are we to do? what should we believe in? what can we know?

so my possibilities aren't really about me, but they are about us.....

so we have dual questions of existence, how can I be a good Catholic?
and what is my relationship with other Catholics or the church or with god?

we have singular relationships like our individual questions about what it means to
be human... as one.....what am I to do?

and we have complex questions of what does it means to be human, collectively....
what are we to do?

every singular question, what am I to do? also has a collective question,
what are we to do?

note, that I am not asking as a white person, or as a man, no, I am
asking a question of everyone who is human, what are we to do?

every question we have, must engage in both our individual selves
and our collective self.....

so this question of what is possible for me, is also a question of
what is possible for us?

it is no longer enough to ask, what can I achieve?
we must ask, what can we achieve?

both questions must be asked.....as individuals and as part of
the collective.....

thus we cannot, as of now, engage with political philosophies
like anarchism because they fail to answer the questions of
us....we must ask questions that engage all of us.....

but this then suggest that our political system, must engage
all of us.... thus we can then rule out such political systems
as monarchy or autocracy or corporatocracy.... because those
political systems don't engage with us... they engage with a
small number of people who rule in our name... but to become
human, fully human, we must engage together... all of us....
as one....democracy is the only real answer to what political
system we can have because it is about us, and not about the "I"...

and this suggests our economic system also... and that isn't
capitalism because capitalism is all about income inequality....
and income inequality isn't about us, it is about a few becoming
wealthy off the work of millions...…..

our political system and our economic system must mirror what it
means to be human.... it must be about all of us.....
and not about the one.. but it must be about the many, us.....

communism/socialism must closely mirrors what it means to be
human far more then capitalism...…

just as democracy mirrors what it means to be human, in
making decisions about our own lives, together...…

it is this relationship between the individual and the collective
that matters.....

it makes a difference in my life if you can't, can't meet your
basic needs of food, water, shelter, education, health care....
if your needs are met, then I can go about meeting my needs....

and we are physical beings, animals in form and we must
meet our bodily needs.... and the best way to accomplish that
is by our collective efforts... we and not me....

but as human beings, we have emotional, psychological needs as well...

and we must engage in those needs as well, needs of love and belonging
and safety/security....

and those needs can only be met within a collective relationship....
it take us to meet those emotional needs..... we need each other
to reach our emotional needs.....

so our real possibilities lie with a more personal understanding
of what we individually need and what we collectively need.....

it is this individual and collective possibilities that we need to
work with and understand....

so we no longer must engage with isms and ideologies
and labels like Catholic or communist or capitalist that
we must engage with but more importantly we must
engage with our human nature with an engagement with
ourselves as individuals and as a collective, us....

Kropotkin
"Those who sacrifice liberty for security
wind up with neither."
"Ben Franklin"
Peter Kropotkin
ILP Legend
 
Posts: 7835
Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2005 1:47 am
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Re: a new understanding of today, time and space.

Postby Peter Kropotkin » Fri May 29, 2020 9:18 pm

How is the "US" engaged when as we discuss our return
from this Pandemic, where workers have no say, no voice
when and if we return to work... we are told, by the business,
the bosses and the government when and how we can return to
work, but we ourselves have no say in the matter.. a matter of
great concern to both us and our families.....

how does this engagement with us happen when, for
example, the women worker in Ohio who make almost
triple what she made while working, in unemployment....
that is patently unfair....why should a worker, working make
less while working then under unemployment?

the conservatives make that an argument to force workers to
go back to work... but the real argument lies with the fact
that we so underpay people, that they make more money on
unemployment...…and meanwhile management makes 100 times
the amount an average worker makes....

How does income inequality make us better as individuals or
as a people/culture/state?

working because you won't have food or have health insurance is
tyranny of the worst kind...…

why? because being moral requires we allow people to meet their
basic needs of food, water, shelter, health care, education...

and our current capitalistic system negates people in
terms of what they need both physically and emotionally...…

we cannot, under our current capitalistic system meet either our
physical and emotional needs.... we cannot find love or peace or
happiness or safety/security or belonging if we are always worried
about our job security....or if, as know to be true, that love
or safety/security or belonging or self esteem is negated under
capitalism...….capitalism denies both our physical and our emotional
needs.... that is why I call capitalism, nihilistic.....

because we have no say, no voice in our economic being,
we are negated, denied who we are and denied our
possibilities.... if we have no voice, no say in what
our political or our economic system, we are, to coin a term,
nihilised….

to put the point bluntly, if we have no say in our situation,
our economic and our political system, then we are nothing more
then slaves.....

that is what slavery is... the denial of freedom, a choice in
who you are and what you can do.....by having no voice in
our political system and having no voice in our economic system,
we are denied our being... we are slaves....

now one might make the argument that by voting, we have choice,
but that is clearly untrue.... this last 4 years has proven that
government is acting under other voices, not ours....

now one may say, IQ45 was properly elected.. but the argument can
be and should be made that the Electoral College, denies our basic
freedom of choice by not allowing the person with the most votes to
become president...… we are a democracy.. and the person with the most
votes should become president... and that is subverted by the
Electoral College... which denies the right of the person with
the most votes to win..... it is anti-democratic....

and IQ45 has clearly denied the voice of the majority of people living
in the US...….

if we have no say in what matters most to our lives, then we
are slaves..

thus to be clear, we in America have not enjoyed real democracy.....

we are some mixed system which denies our right to make our
voice heard....

either we go all in on democracy or we end this.....
there is no choice.. we cannot go on pretending to have
a voice in our political affairs when we do not
and we can't even pretend to have a voice in our
economic affairs...…

to be able to choose what kind of toothpaste I can buy isn't
economic freedom.. it isn't having a choice, a voice in our affairs....

it is still slavery.. but with toothpaste.....

having a say in our workplace.. having a say when and how we return
to our jobs... that is the type of economic freedom I am talking about.....

having a voice in how we do our jobs and what our economic status is...
that is true freedom and truly what it means to be empowered as human beings....

one of the conditions of being human, fully human demands that we have
a voice, a say in both our political and economic life.....if we do not,
then we are slaves... politically and economically...…

if we are not free to act upon our personal and collective needs,
then we are not being treated morally....morality demands that
we are able to fulfill our needs, both physical and emotionally....

our political and economic system isn't moral...
that is the bottom line...….

and part of being human, fully human is to go beyond our
basic physical and emotional needs... to reach the point of
our being able to self actualize.... to reach our full potential...
to discover our possibilities...

and we cannot, cannot get to reaching our full potential if
we can't even reach our basic physical and emotional needs
because of our political and economic system...….

every question is question about who we are, what we can achieve,
what we can do...…

either we include everyone or we continue to be slaves.....

our own individual pursuit is contingent upon our collective
pursuit.... we can only reach our individual goal if we help
everyone reach their individual goal...…

my being able to reach my needs and desires and wants is
dependent upon you reaching your needs and desires and wants....

so what is required?

we must reevaluate our own personal needs and desires and wants....
instead of me, I must ask, how do we achieve our needs, desires and wants?

and what are those personal needs, desires and wants?

do we really want or are we indoctrinated into thinking that is
our needs, desires and wants?

the voice inside my head telling me what I need, what I want,
what I desire... is that really my voice or is that the indoctrination
I received as a child?

Kropotkin
"Those who sacrifice liberty for security
wind up with neither."
"Ben Franklin"
Peter Kropotkin
ILP Legend
 
Posts: 7835
Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2005 1:47 am
Location: blue state

Re: a new understanding of today, time and space.

Postby Peter Kropotkin » Fri May 29, 2020 9:45 pm

complexity... humans have grown in complexity....
we are no longer animals which are limited by their very
nature to be simple, not complex....

a dog or a cat is less complex then a human being.....

our modern world is far more complex then the world
of the cave man under the hunter-gather society.....

and our modern world is far more complex then the ancient
Greek or Roman society....

and at every increase in complexity, we need to involved more
and more people....complexity requires more moving parts...
that is the nature of complexity....

our animal brethren.. their needs are simple.... meeting their physical
requirements is enough for them.....

but we humans.. we cannot be satisfied with just meeting our physical needs....

we also required our emotional and psychological needs to be met...
without meeting our emotional and psychological needs,
we are maladjusted and stunted.. not fully human....

we are complex animals and the more complex we become,
the more we must have our needs and desires and wants to be met....

our political and economic systems must also need to meet our
complex needs... that requires a complex political and economic
system...…

for example, if we are unable to have a voice in the matters like
if and when we return to work, then we are, as noted before, slaves....
and our emotional and psychological needs like belonging is unmet....
how can we say we belong to an economic system or a political system
that has no interest in our voice....the new political and economic
system of the future, must include our voices in the who, what, when,
where, how and why of our jobs, our companies, our entire economic
system.....

the existential questions of, what am I to do, is directly tied up
in this question of, do I have a voice in that which matters to me most?

am I a slave or am I a human being?

to have a voice, to have a say in what matters to me most,
is being a human being.... not to have a voice or a say in
matters like the political or economic system is to be an
animal...…

what makes me a human being is choices....

animals can choose very little, but I can choose to
become what I am, I can choose to be human.. and
have a say in what matters most to me...….

if I have no choice, I am not free, I am not a human being....
I am a slave....an animal....

so what is your choice? and that choice defines you as
being human...…not slave or not animal.....

Kropotkin
"Those who sacrifice liberty for security
wind up with neither."
"Ben Franklin"
Peter Kropotkin
ILP Legend
 
Posts: 7835
Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2005 1:47 am
Location: blue state

Re: a new understanding of today, time and space.

Postby Peter Kropotkin » Fri May 29, 2020 10:50 pm

increase complexity requires increased comprehension and
increased adaptability....

in other words... I am born.. I have very limited exposure
and understanding of the world I was born into....

and by age 3, I have an increased understanding of the world into
which I was born....because of the process that is part of being
human, I have changed physically, mentally, emotionally and
psychologically from birth to age 3 and I will continue to change
as I grow older.. at age 10, I am a completely different person
from age 3.... and we must continue to engage in this process
of changing and adapting to the environment...

I cannot function as a 20 year old with a 10 year old understanding
of the universe.....my mental and emotional and psychological
nature must change and adapt as I grow older..... I see the
world differently at 40 then I did at 20 or at age 10.....

and as a senior citizen, I see the world completely different then
I did as a 40 year old or as a 20 year... I must change to adapt
to the ever changing conditions I find myself in....

my mindset today is completely different now that I am 61....
I am seriously trying to figure out a way to retire and still
be able to meet my basic needs of food, water, shelter,
health care and education..... I just don't have the money
to retire....

whereas when I was 40, I was still engage in the process of
thinking about a job or promotions or how much I was making...

today, I just don't give a shit about my job, any promotions
or how much I am making outside of, does this amount
help me retire?

my life was engaging in increased complexity.. from grade school to
high school to work was an increasing level of complexity....
today, I am at the point, where I want less, far less complexity in
my life....

I have matured enough to see most of my life was engaged in pursuing
crap....needless and unnecessary crap that didn't improve my life
one iota....

this is far different then where I was at age 20 or 30 or even 40.....

my journey or path to old age has taught me lessons I never
even imagined when I was younger....

and this is how it is supposed to work.....

we grow and change and become something new
every single day...…

and within that change, comes lessons in entropy
and process and becoming...…

I finally, truly understand what entropy means to a human being
because I am a victim of entropy where I am losing more energy
then I can put in....it isn't real noticeable but it is there...…
and I suspect as I grow older, I will more and more notice
the impact that entropy will have on my life....

and enough entropy in my life means I will die..... simple as that...
no matter what I do, entropy will end my life at some point in time.....

so we must learn to see our lives in the context of energy
and entropy and change and process and time and complexity
and needs and desires and wants...….

that is the lesson I learned too late....

these lessons are not the lessons we got in grade school or high
school or in college...…

we were taught the wrong lessons in school.....

instead of learning a skill to have a job, we should
have been taught to become human and what does it
mean to be human.....

and to be human means we are subject to increased complexity
and changes in our life up until the day we die and in fact, death
is the last, final change we go through in life....

adaption and complexity and process and change.... these are the
real skills we should be educated in...

not in math or in history or social studies.. but how to deal with
complexity and change and processes in life...…

"what does it mean to grow old" should be a required course in school instead
of economics or social science.....

the how in life is far less important then the why...…

what lessons have you learned in life?

and did school teach you those lessons or did you
learn the important lessons while engage in life?

that is why I believe that education before 1900 was far more
useful then education today... because the lesson in school was
to train men into being gentlemen... men learned the important
skills of being a gentleman which was the entire point of education
in schools....not in being trained in a skill to earn a living, but
how to live life...… that what is missing in education today....
we learn unimportant stuff like math skills or what date was
the declaration of independence was signed..

what we need school for is, how do we engage with life,
with its complexity and change and the process of growing older.....

those are the lessons we should be learning, not that the earth is 93
million miles from the sun... that information teaches us nothing
about what it means to be human.....or how to deal with change in
our life...…or how to deal with increasing complexity in our lives.....

our educational system is a failure because it doesn't teach us
how to be human..... it simply teaches us facts or skills for a job...
and that tells us nothing about how to be human....

I can tell you all kinds of facts and information but can I tell
you how to engage in your life with its increasing complexity?

I doubt it...…

so what does it mean to be human? what does it mean to engage in
the complexity of our daily life? How are we going to learn how to
change and adapt to the every changing complexity, processes and
viewpoint that is life itself?

how do I go from "I" to "us"? these are the lessons we must learn...
not how to add 15 + 15 = 30..... what does math mean to me as a human being,
that is the question, not what does math mean by itself.....

Kropotkin
"Those who sacrifice liberty for security
wind up with neither."
"Ben Franklin"
Peter Kropotkin
ILP Legend
 
Posts: 7835
Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2005 1:47 am
Location: blue state

Re: a new understanding of today, time and space.

Postby Peter Kropotkin » Sat May 30, 2020 1:32 am

So, one might argue that Kropotkin wants everyone to
march in communistic bootsteps.... we dress the same
and live the same and eat the same and work the same...

Hardly... we can be individuals within a family as in a small
group and in a work environment and within the society/state/culture....

I don't believe marching in the same fascist boot steps will solve
anything.... we don't have to believe in the same facts or in the same
god or in the same ism and ideology.....

that is not the goal.... the goal is to fight entropy by increasing
the amount of energy going into any system....

and that can be achieved in any number of ways...….

we have to become aware of our systems as they engage....
if we are aware of how our so called democracy works today,
we can see we do not have any democracy in America today.....

but to achieve true democracy, we don't have to march in step with
each other.... we simply have to engage as is possible for us.....

I am old.. I can't physically engage like I was once able to …
so my means of engagement will be different then a young, physically
able lad can.....I can't fight or brawl like I once could have... I must find
a different, suitable means of engagement with society and the state.....

I believe each of us can contribute in different ways to the cause of
choices and freedom and change....

we have many different and diverse roads or paths to the same goal.....

will I be manning the barricades? I doubt it.. but I will be offering what
is appropriate to my age and current abilities...

the spirit is willing but the body, not so much...…

I must engage as I can...…

as you must engage as you must...…

but that doesn't require us to be dressed the same or speaking the same language
or both being white or male or loving the same gender.....

we can march to the same goal and still be quite different people....

it is our differences that makes us strong, not our sameness...….

so join me in marching, be it in pants or dress or naked, I really don't care
who you are or what is your color or gender or sexual orientation or nationality....

I only ask for tolerance and inclusion and acceptance....

be who you are and march with me toward a future where
we can be ourselves and still allow the equation of existence to
be maintained and the entropy be held equal in all our systems...….

Kropotkin
"Those who sacrifice liberty for security
wind up with neither."
"Ben Franklin"
Peter Kropotkin
ILP Legend
 
Posts: 7835
Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2005 1:47 am
Location: blue state

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