a new understanding of today, time and space.

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Re: a new understanding of today, time and space.

Postby Peter Kropotkin » Mon Dec 02, 2019 6:28 pm

I came across this Paragraph while reading William Barrett book,
"What is Existentialism?" and it suggests something...

…."in the seventeenth century this rational soul falls within the
framework of a universe whose basic features are expressed by the
physical notions of Newton. The fundamental key to the human
situation becomes the relation of the rational soul to this inertly
material universe: Man becomes the epistemological animal"

Our understanding of the universe, our explanation of the universe
becomes an understanding of this "inertly material universe".
Man become a animal engaged in knowledge.. what is knowledge,
what can we know, what are the limits to knowledge....

and lo and behold we have the man who tries to explain the
universe in exactly these terms... Descartes....and from Descartes
to Kant, we have philosophy attempting to explain the universe in
in the understanding of knowledge.....

then we have Hegel who place philosophy into a historical perspective....
we now see philosophy having a history and being within history...
before Hegel, philosophy didn't have a history.. it was simply
a study of isolated idea's that didn't extend in time....
so the study of being, the basic understanding that the Greeks
had of the universe was a study of being, as of right now..
what does being mean to me right now? it has no past or future
to it....being was study as a stand alone idea with nothing
attached to it....and we could take aim at ancient philosophers for
not understanding being in a historical context.. what does being look like
across time? and all hail Hegel for his extremely valuable contributions to
philosophy....but as philosophy lies within history, philosophy itself changed....

the 19th century tried something different then an understanding of
man within the context of knowledge, the epistemology animal...
thinkers and philosophers tried to understand man in a different sense,
and this includes Hegel.....the 19the century could be thought of as the
"Ism" century...how do we understand man within the context of the various
"Ism" that exists....this is a good way to understand Marx....how does man/human beings
exists within the context of communism or how does man exists within the context of
capitalism or how does man/human beings exists within the various ism's of democracy
or Catholicism or Buddhism or ……….what does it mean to be human in the
context of a democratic state? so people were studied and understood in
context of their place within some ism or ideology.... but we have Kierkegaard,
who wanted to put man front and center of any understanding of the universe.....

what is my role, the individual's role, within the larger context of the world...

his concerns were the existentialist concerns of what does it all mean to me?

K. rejected systems because man/human beings would be lost, his needs lost
and K. thought religiously, man religious needs would be lost in a world
where we are just cogs in the machine....

and he was right.... we are cogs in the machine and we have lost not only
the religious within us, but we have lost the chance to plot our own course
of exploration of who we are and what are we to become... by this I mean,
our course is set when we are young... schooling, perhaps collage, then a job,
a house, two cars, a wife, two kids and a dog name spot... work for 40 years then retire...
that is the "American dream"...…..

it is a materialistic dream for a materialistic world...the existentialist questions
of meaning or of becoming who you are, are simply avoided, dismissed, driven
away from us with 40 years of nonsense of being in the working world.....

we are suppose to be rational, logical, realist, pragmatic... just like Zero..
who prides himself on being a realist, pragmatic.. a modern man...
whereas, he has accused me of being a naïve idealist... a dreamer,
not a realist, not a pragmatist.... in other words, he is accusing me
of not being a modern man....Zero rails against the modern world and
yet he the representative "modern" man that he argues against....
(now whither he is actually rational, logical, a realist or pragmatic,
is doubtful, but let us take him at his word)

as for me, I am a dreamer for I dream of a better world..a world
apart, separate from the nihilistic modern world that has dehumanized
and devalued human beings and their values.... Zero fits into
such a world because his values fit quite nicely into our modern
nihilistic world.. whereas I oppose and fight the modern world....

I oppose the notion of man as an "epistemology animal" that
we are animals that seek knowledge and the limits of knowledge....

the last century could be considered to be the "epistemology age"
where "knowledge is power" as they say....personally, I have quite
a bit of knowledge.. I know the population of New York and what
H2O means and I know what "epistemology" means... but that
knowledge isn't what is important nor does that knowledge
allow me to gain what is most important, wisdom...

the pursuit of knowledge, which is the same as the pursuit of profits,
leads us nowhere... if profit or knowledge is the goal, it has to
be used to do something to be of use...by itself, profits or knowledge
has no value.. it only has value if it is used to get to some other goal....

that is the problem with profit/money or knowledge... it has no intrinsic value
of its own....profit/knowledge can only be used as a means to some other goal...
it is not an end or a goal.. it is a means....

and that is why, in part, why I rail against profit... it has no value....
unless it is in context of something else.....

I search for the goal, the end game, not the means to the end game.....

and what does it mean to be a human being?

the end game....

Kropotkin
"Those who sacrifice liberty for security
wind up with neither."
"Ben Franklin"
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Re: a new understanding of today, time and space.

Postby Peter Kropotkin » Mon Dec 02, 2019 7:06 pm

I have a very large library.. I have over 5000 books.. and quite
a few are fiction books, many of the classics, Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky
and James Joyce and Homer and Sherwood Anderson and Andrei Bely..

I have read most if not all of them, the one exception is Tolstoy
"War and Peace" and frankly, I just can't get into it....I cannot
keep up with the cast of thousands...

the fiction books don't tell us what man is, they show us...
man as animal.. we eat and drink and fuck and fight and hate
and love.....

and some, some show us something higher...man as possibilities...
especially Science Fiction books....The Foundation series for example
or Star Trek.....we think of ourselves as being fix, set in our being
human beings... but as Nietzsche correctly pointed out, we are
beings going from somewhere to somewhere... and in that going from
and to, we are ever changing...modern man is different from the man
from the enlightenment, I am different then Voltaire because I live
in a far different age....my viewpoint is far different.. my understanding
of what it means to be human is different.....and in all my books and in all
the thousands of books I have read over these last 50 years, only a few have
profoundly changed me, I shall write of just one, Report to Greco by Kazantzakis


for Kazantzakis, the point of being human is the struggle.. he is always
writing of the struggle... for K. his description of being human is the struggle
to met God.. and his struggle is always about going up a mountain...
and in going up the mountain to met god, we fall down and we get dirty
and we get distracted and we fight and ague and eat and drink and fuck
and hate and love...….but we must never lose sight of the fact that
we are struggling to met god.....but Kropotkin, you don't believe in god...
you are correct, I don't... but that doesn't mean that I can't accept the idea
of the struggle, but instead of meeting god, we are struggling to
understand what it means to be human and to become more human....

instead of reaching down and becoming animal, we struggle to become
better human beings by reaching to our higher values instead of our lower values...
we struggle to be more just and to be love and to become more charitable
and to limit if not remove the distance between our actions and our words....
to say what we mean and to mean what we say and have our words match
our actions.... that is the human struggle... to become more human, not less...

my books show me what it means to be human, in all their flaws and it is
ok to have flaws, I have many, but one must struggle, engage with those
flaws and attempt to rise above them....not to just be an animal/ human who
simply engages day to day without any thought to what it means to be
human and what will it take to rise above that human nature.. the flaws...

if I engage with my values, values of justice and love and charity
and hope.. among other values... then I engage with becoming more
human.....if I engage with my lower animal values of hate, injustice,
anger, lust, greed, then I am engaging with my lower animal values..
I cannot become more human by engaging with my lower animal values.....

the quest, the struggle, the path as understood by Nietzsche, is to
grow into something else.....the changing of the caterpillar into a
butterfly..... right now, we humans are caterpillar... and we must
begin the change into the butterfly....how?

once again, the start begins with becoming aware of..
knowing that there is a struggle to become more human..
the path is often found, once awareness is achieved.....

the struggle is not to amass more wealth or in fame or
women sexually, but to find out who you are and become
something more.....the mountain awaits you....do you have
the courage to begin the climb?

Kropotkin
"Those who sacrifice liberty for security
wind up with neither."
"Ben Franklin"
Peter Kropotkin
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Re: a new understanding of today, time and space.

Postby Dan~ » Mon Dec 02, 2019 7:37 pm

instead of reaching down and becoming animal, we struggle to become
better human beings by reaching to our higher values instead of our lower values...
we struggle to be more just and to be love and to become more charitable
and to limit if not remove the distance between our actions and our words....
to say what we mean and to mean what we say and have our words match
our actions.... that is the human struggle... to become more human, not less...


I try to reach for the best instead of the most pleasant.
That is very hard in its own way.
I like http://www.accuradio.com , internet radio.
https://dannerz.itch.io/ -- a new and minimal webside now hosting two of my free game projects.
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Re: a new understanding of today, time and space.

Postby Peter Kropotkin » Mon Dec 02, 2019 7:47 pm

Dan~ wrote:
instead of reaching down and becoming animal, we struggle to become
better human beings by reaching to our higher values instead of our lower values...
we struggle to be more just and to be love and to become more charitable
and to limit if not remove the distance between our actions and our words....
to say what we mean and to mean what we say and have our words match
our actions.... that is the human struggle... to become more human, not less...


I try to reach for the best instead of the most pleasant.
That is very hard in its own way.



K: that works... it is about becoming the best in us, not the worse...

Kropotkin
"Those who sacrifice liberty for security
wind up with neither."
"Ben Franklin"
Peter Kropotkin
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Posts: 7495
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Re: a new understanding of today, time and space.

Postby Peter Kropotkin » Fri Dec 06, 2019 7:08 pm

I have mentioned this before, but it is worth returning to....

our modern notion of superhero's...why suddenly during the
30's and thereafter, why do we have this need for superhero's?

I would suggest that they are a response to the environment that
we found ourselves in....the Greeks created a whole slew of mythic
entities that fulfilled a function for them...the Creation of the Gods,
Hera and Apollo and Poseidon and Zeus were all created to met some
basic Greek need.. they also invented hero's like Hercules and Achilles….
which are no different then our need to invent hero's like Superman
and Batman...let us engage in some minor speculation about this need
for superhero's....

If I were to guess, this need for superhero's is because the feeling of
not having some control over one's life..... we cannot influence or
control what is happening to us, so we create superhero's as a response
to our lack of influence within our environment...

individually, I have no influenced over the course of human events...
the events of modern times that have dominated and changed my life lies
outside of my influence or control.... the Industrial revolution has completely
change what life was about...we have existed for so long under the Industrial
revolution that we cannot even imagine a world without it... but no so long ago,
for the average person, they lived on a farm and lived a rural, agricultural life....
time clocks mean nothing in this life... the seasons of spring and summer and
fall and winter, those were the clocks that farmers used.... for over a thousand
years, people didn't travel more then a 100 miles from their home during their
entire lifetime...if disaster came to these people, it was in the form of bad weather
or crops failing or troop movement over their farm land.... and in the winter months,
people didn't work or they might have gotten small menial labor jobs.....you just
didn't farm during the winter months....then came the industrial revolution.
millions of people left the farmland to get better jobs in the city...
and we have the modern age impact of the modern wars and the great
Depression.... Superman was created during the Great Depression, in 1938
and the second world war was on the horizon...…. that Superman has been
the focal point of much discussion regarding the Archetype that Superman
represented and that can be easily found on the internet...…

but for me, it is why, why do we need superhero's in this modern age?

the average person wants to see justice done and in this modern world,
we, as individuals, cannot find justice on our own.... the world is too big...
if Ford builds cars that kill people, we as individual cannot do anything about it...
we must hope that the government, being the only entity big and powerful enough
to impact Ford... and therein lies the key... for justice to be served, we must have
one entity be larger then the evil entity for justice to be enabled... in other words,
a large multinational corporation commits evil, the only force strong enough to combat
it is something larger and more powerful... we inherently see this... to combat
evil requires something larger and more powerful then evil.... the problem lies
with the fact that we see powerful institutions like the Bureaucracies like
congress or the presidency act in a way that seems to us, to be evil
and we have no recourse to overcome such acts of evil..... we see the need
for some outside force to bring evil to justice and we turn to not only superman but
we turn to such movie hero's as Jason Bourne and the Terminator in the later movies...
and the avengers....we find relief that Justice can be brought down upon those who
threaten society... justice that we personally cannot fulfill... and we feel helpless
and vulnerable so we might even turn to the strong man concept in the political.....

many turn to IQ45 as a strong man because they feel so weak and helpless
and vulnerable.... it is no different then wishing that we had a superman to
right the wrongs we see in modern life...….of course, IQ45 failed us because
he is a con man, a fraud, a cheater and we were the ones he cheated.....
so, we were burned and taken advantage of....and those who are cheated often
feel that they can't trust anyone anymore and so they turn their back on
politics and the political and they hid inside within the world of their own
creation. be it movies or video games or watching shows like Entertainment tonight
or TMZ or E! news... what better way to escape the real world then watching these
fake news shows...and we moderns have a wide variety of means of escaping the real
world either by the creation of a world inside of us or by the taking of drugs or other
addictions like booze or sex or gambling.....

if you feel you have no say or influence, no power over your own life, then escape
seems to be the modern route to take...…. and this is one function of
having superhero's....

Kropotkin
"Those who sacrifice liberty for security
wind up with neither."
"Ben Franklin"
Peter Kropotkin
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Re: a new understanding of today, time and space.

Postby Peter Kropotkin » Fri Dec 06, 2019 11:37 pm

oh, you who desire fire and the sword to end our days, has
history ever fulfilled your fantasy? No, the phoenix has never
risen after the fire and death and destruction that you so loudly
preach for....no, after the fire and the end of America only
comes more fire and more death and more destruction.. what you sow,
is what you reap... read your history and you see this to be true....
the violent end of every civilization has only sowed the
next crop of death and fire and destruction and violence....

nothing can arise from such fire and destruction... it is barren
and sterile... nothing can arise from the charred ruins of society....

and why? because the fire and violence and destruction is based upon
anger and greed and hatred and bigotry... nothing can be built upon
a foundation of hate or violence or greed or anger...nothing.....

look around you.. what has anger and death and hate and violence ever built?

nothing....

what has love built?

why everything...

in building, the key is the foundation... when a foundation is weak, it is at risk
of falling down...a family whose foundation is strong, that family will thrive
and grow even during adversity.. a family whose foundation is weak, any type
of adversity will destroy that family...

the rock upon which every strong family is built... is love.....
and the same is true of every human institution....those institutions
built upon anger or hatred or violence never last long.... they can't..
their very foundations are weak and the slightest storm will blow that
house down....

any house built of love or justice or freedom or charity will have a strong
foundation... and that house will last and thrive even during the worst of storms.....

as part of my evidence is the NRA... it did fine when the conditions were
ok... but once the storm came, the NRA wasn't built upon the higher human
values like love or hope or justice...the NRA was built upon anger and hate
and injustice and violence and the first storm that came its way, has damaged
the NRA to the point of it being close to collapse....

you who preach destruction based upon anger and hatred and greed..
you will not find the destruction you wrought as bringing you the rise of
the new and shiny new society you prayed for...for from death and destruction
and anger can only come death and destruction and anger.....
and only from love and peace and justice and freedom can come
love and peace and justice and freedom...

whatever we sow, we shall reap....

Kropotkin
"Those who sacrifice liberty for security
wind up with neither."
"Ben Franklin"
Peter Kropotkin
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Re: a new understanding of today, time and space.

Postby Peter Kropotkin » Sun Dec 08, 2019 7:25 pm

in thinking about our "modern" times, I confess
I am at a loss to understand these forlorn times....

I think of the epochs before us, the Medieval and the Renaissance are two
such periods... then comes the reformation and the counter reformation....
then comes the Enlightenment and its opposite, the Romantic age...
then we reach Nietzsche's age of nihilism....the 20th century... each age,
with something we don't have today.... each age provided human beings with
an understanding of what "MAN" was... each age had its understanding of what
it meant to be human...each age had something we do not have today,
which is that we don't have any description of what it means to be human..
and that is the difference between our age and any other age before it...

think of the Greeks and the Romans and the Medieval man... each of them
had an understanding of what it meant to be human... something we don't
have today...… and that, in part, explains why we so struggle today...
we lack something very fundamental to our understanding of the universe....
we lack a picture of what it means to be human.....

and much of our confusion and alienation and disconnect arises
because we lack an understanding of what it means to be human....

we have no picture of what it means to be human and so we don't
have any sense of where we were, where we are and where we need
to be... past, present and future only makes sense if we have an understanding
of the possibilities, the choices of what it means to be human.....

and that is what it means to understand what it means to be human,
it is about our possibilities, what is possible for us as human beings....

we cannot strive for anything if we don't know what our possibilities
are...…….. we lack, not only the answers but we lack the questions....
and until we engage with what it means to be human, we cannot
continue our journey into the future...… we are stuck until we
begin the engagement with that it means to be human....
which is a dialogue about the possibilities that lies before us
as human beings.....what is possible for us? individually and collectively....

until we answer this fundamental question, we cannot resume the voyage
to what it means to be human...……

we mistake our technical world as being what we are as human beings...
but technology is simply a tool, science is a tool.... what does
that science, that technology say about us? we have to put the human being
before the science and before the technology.....we have made a fundamental mistake
by thinking we are technological, scientific beings before our real nature which
is what we are trying to discover.... we are human being who use science and technology,
not scientific/technical creatures who happen to be human...… the humanity must
come before the science/technology.... don't mistake the tools for the creature..
as we have done over these last 200 years...….. the human being comes before
the science or technology.....

we mistake the ism's and ideologies of Marxism and communism and democracy
as being a survey of what it means to be human... they are ism' and ideologies,
tools for us to discover what it means to be human.... we are mistaking the tools
of human beings for what it means to be human....

learn to separate the tools from an understanding of what it means to be human....

we are not homo Economicus nor are we Homo habilis nor are we homo erectus....

we are homo sapiens.... beings that are human.....and what does that mean?

Kropotkin
"Those who sacrifice liberty for security
wind up with neither."
"Ben Franklin"
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Re: a new understanding of today, time and space.

Postby Peter Kropotkin » Mon Dec 09, 2019 12:18 am

if I may be so bold to question..

why has philosophy failed in our modern times?

think of art and how it is done....

the Japanese for example, they don't create art the same way
as we in the west do....

think about the Japanese method of Archery...
as they aim for the target, they imagine themselves
as being the arrow.. they become part of the art..
the same goes for painting...

artists imagine themselves within the painting... they are painting the art
as if they were inside the picture....

we in the west stand outside of the art and look at the art...
and those in the east imagine themselves within the art....

and therein lies the failure of modern philosophy... we in the west see
philosophy objectively, outside of us, as if we were looking at a picture...

we don't see ourselves as part of the picture... and in philosophy, we
don't see ourselves as part of the act of philosophy....philosophy is separate,
apart from us... whereas to engage in philosophy, truly to engage within philosophy
we must become part of philosophy.. painting within the picture as it were....

philosophy exists outside of us, apart and separate.. something we view
as independent of us....instead of living philosophy... we don't philosophize seriously
enough to engage with philosophy as something inside of us.....it lies viewed but
not engaged with....

and that is why philosophy has lost the respect of the public...

philosophy has failed because we see it like a TV show... we watch it,
and we critiqued it, but we don't live it...…. and until philosophy becomes
something that lies within us and part of us, it won't have any following or
respect...outside of professional professors... as long as philosophy is a
spectator sport, it will never impact anyone including you.....

Kropotkin
"Those who sacrifice liberty for security
wind up with neither."
"Ben Franklin"
Peter Kropotkin
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