Rational and Emotional Responsibility

[James_S_Saint]

@Arcturus Descending

James wrote:

But very many, especially women, dislike the notion that people should be rational.

BIAS ALERT! BIAS ALERT!

So just what are you saying here? That women particularly enjoy being irrational and enjoy the irrationality of others, James?
Are you saying that women actually ENJOY being irrational?

Most, yes; “I want what I want, when I wan’t, no matter how irrational. If you want to be my man, control my desire” - the Eve Archetype.

@Arcturus Descending

They consciously go out of their way to be this way?

They need not go out of their way. Their way is irrationality already (although certainly not “ALL” women).

@Arcturus Descending

Are you saying, for instance, that they enjoy the irrationality that comes with being abused by their husbands?

Their irrationality IS the abuse of their husbands.

…{{not that males are saints}}.

[encode_decode]

WendyDarling

Justice is very tricky . . . very . . . I see where you are coming from - I really like that it is coming from the heart.

@WendyDarling

Justice is a tricky one. If everyone shared their goodness, we wouldn’t need justice.

I wonder though - even in a perfect world whether we would not need justice.

= = = |< 0 >| = = =

If I may - I want to explore the dictionary from google . . .

a) just behavior or treatment.
b) the quality of being fair and reasonable.
c) the administration of the law or authority in maintaining this.
2.
a judge or magistrate, in particular a judge of the Supreme Court of a country or state.

Should we not be our own administrator of our selves . . . to discipline ourselves
. . . in a fair and reasonable way . . . so as not to harm others
so as not to harm ourselves . . . to judge ourselves

??? . . to be the magistrate in our own state of mind . . ???

Do unto others . . .

[Arcturus_Descending]

encode_decode

Does one actually have to look happy on the outside to actually be happy on the inside?

No, of course not. It depends on the individual.
Some people smile and pretend to be happy when they actually are not. It’s a mask they wear because they do not want people to feel them as it were in their vulnerability or perhaps they feel that no one would care anyway.

How happy is happy though, encode_decode? Is happiness ALSO inner serenity and stillness?
One does not need to look happy to be happy but then again, I think that something has to shine through on one’s face. Not sure what it is though.
We are all different individuals though.

I am suggesting that by being rational we can control our emotional state. This requires consistency of behavior.

I like that word “suggesting”. It means what you are saying is not set in stone and that you are open to discussion. I will have to keep that train of thought in mind.
I agree with you there too. But I also think that it can be like a “catch 22” no?
We have to be rational people in the first place in order to control our emotional state. I’m not sure that I expressed what I wanted to there.
Yes, I agree again. It does require consistency of behavior. It requires discipline/endurance/self-awareness in and out of the moment.
Doesn’t it also require a mind which is usually reasonable and rational?
Can we get blood from a stone?

I believe more than ninety five percent of the time we can maintain a calm state through consistency of behavior.

How did you arrive at that percentage?
Again, I think that would depend on the individual. But you are probably thinking in terms of an individual who is basically calm, cool and collected usually. Not usually phased by something, not usually goes off when something triggers him or her…your basic rational, reasonable and logical man.
God where can i find one of those? lol

You may be correct but I’m just not sure of that 95% but how would I know anyway?

So maybe not all the time. But at no time do I see emotions as an excuse for insanity - even in the court room.

Hmmm…now that I am not sure of. I mean really. I’m not sure of that.
Wouldn’t an insane person necessarily be out of their minds with uncontrollable emotion?

Arcturus Descending wrote:
Do you think that a highly rational person at times needs a breather from the rational - needs to allow him/her self at times to just let go and allow feeling to come into play?

Yes I do as a matter of fact. I believe one should let there imagination run wild - this is healthy for invention and the arts too.

In what other way might a highly rational man benefit from taking a breather from his rational logical mind?

Arcturus Descending
At the same time, I don’t mean to suggest that a highly rational person is a non-feeling person. Can they be? I don’t know.

That state left over when you believe that you are void of emotion I am certain is still an emotional state and you are in fact deluding yourself to believe that you could ever be void of emotion and still remain as you were meant to be - this could be argued - but what would you be arguing the case of?

Hmmm… that’s not an easy one for me. I don’t think that anyone is ever devoid of emotion.
It always lies there, somewhere within. Maybe I’m speaking more of potential emotion as opposed to say kinetic lol emotion.
But if you are speaking about when a human being comes down from an emotional, a highly emotional experience, no matter what it is, that takes a while to dwindle down to a simple ripple within. I think that is different for everyone. I don’t think that we can command our negative emotions to just up and leave.
When we are in an emotional state, then who is it that is the master and who is it that is the slave?
How does the slave eventually come to see who is the master? Does the master beat the seeing into the slave?
You tell me.

Would a highly rational person come down quicker than one who is not? Maybe not. Could it be because the highly rational person is not so equipped to handle his emotions. Okay, I’m ranting here. I’m losing myself.
I may not have answered your question in the way you meant it.

Perhaps your desire to be a robot -

No not really but I will say that there have been times when I could say, as Quasimoto said to that rock - “I wish I could have been made of stone like thee” and honestly come close to meaning it or almost meaning it.
Thankfully, I have no choice on the matter. Not really.

perhaps a much more complex form of life than a single celled organism devoid of emotion.

But are we not already such complex like forms, we humans?

Ask yourself then what is your life without emotion - without fear - without happiness - You have to dig deep for the answers - not rely on what you have learnt but add to it.

You are basically speaking to the choir here, encode_decode.
I am known by some to be quite the emotional person, more often that not but that might also depend on the circumstances. I have often times wished that I could be less so, not altogether so but less so.
But I would never opt to become like Data, never having or tasting a real human experience…just simply having that cerebral unexperience of what it is to be human.

do you honestly think that emotion is not an advanced form of stimulus?

I never thought of the word or the concept in terms of being an advanced form of stimulus.
I do think that evolution-wise, our emotions can be both beneficial and destructive.
But we cannot lose the one in order to lose the other. We have to learn to find that middle path, to balance out that teeter-totter ride.
We have to learn to value emotions without seeking that high flair of adrenaline which can happen or that soaring of joy and pleasure although that soaring of joy and pleasure comes to us. It is something which happens to us. Can we avoid it? No, not unless we give up our humanity. I think that our emotions can be what saves the world at times and at other times destroys it. I think I said that before.
I guess at some point we will see in which direction we go.

Arcturus Descending

Oh, I can’t forget my own mandate to look to the individual.

What do you mean by this?

Just that, as I have said, we are not all peas in the same pod. We feel differently, we think differently, we behave differently, we worship differently, we have been raised differently. We are all unique in our own way. Sometimes we just need to search that out.
Why judge a whole group by the actions and thoughts of a few.
Why dress everyone with the same colored coat? We are all multitudinous in our individuality.

[encode_decode]

Arcturus Descending

I must say that I am really quite impressed by your post, I will be answering it properly soon - for now I owe you a response or two in another thread so I will make a comment on one element of your post.

@Arcturus Descending

Hmmm… that’s not an easy one for me. I don’t think that anyone is ever devoid of emotion.

I agree - even for those who don’t express it, emotion is still there. The only cases I can think of would involve serious disabilities.