You must not get out very often as they are a majority everywhere.
Deception marked as wisdom. How quaint.
Oh that so hurts
Well… If the one thing you look for is as perfect of wisdom and representation of that in behavior (embodying perfect wisdom) you’ll run across all manner of things and likely not miss very much.
I hope it does.
Of course you would.
Women call it love when they’re pinned down, fucked hard, and flowers left for them in the morning.
The flowers are the important part.
Yes, of course.
if there isn’t any secret agonizing sadness behind the feeling of love then it isn’t real love. the first thing I feel toward something I love is the despair at the knowledge that it will eventually perish. this is completely disinterested and without any selfish interests… the grief in knowing something great will eventually cease to exist. if you feel that toward the object you think you love, then you truly love it. if you just feel lonely when without them or something cheesy like that… that’s not love.
this kind of rich existential love transcends the kinds of gender and role based kinds of love. romantic love, familial love, paternal love, etc.
You’re a woman!!! I thought you were a man, HaHaHa 
Zoot Allures
That’s not necessarily true for everyone, Zooty. I may be wrong here but that might just be (I’m not saying it’s you) but it might just be the personality of someone who has lost in the game of love (it can also be considered a game considering how people “play” at it) or someone who cannot trust or someone who is always waiting for the other shoe to drop…someone with a neurotic personality…or a pessismist.
Things change, people change, that doesn’t necessarily mean that love changes or dies. Well, yes, ob viously it has to but in another sense, it it still remains, the memory of it, the experience of it.
Why deliberately go out of our way to focus on how someday love will be lost? We lose the present moment of loving then ---------- hopefully a very long one and the gratitude that that love can instill within us.
There is nothing wrong with interests focused toward the self - depending on one’s behavior and the consequences of that
~~ but…
…I have no idea how you could possibly make the above quote with regard to your below quote.
if there isn’t any secret agonizing sadness behind the feeling of love then it isn’t real love.
They just don’t seem to harmonize for me.
Again, I may be wrong here but I intuit otherwise. You can’t intuit that as being self-interested - maybe part of the fear of loss more so than the joy of loving - giving and receiving love in the moment, Zooty?
If you read the context of the sentence I was stating there is no woman with the personality like myself.
Sorry to say, Zoot, but I think this is complete bullshit.
There is never a complete lack of selfish interest in anything we do. Lack of selfish objectives maybe, but just in order to be motivated to do something–anything–there has to be some return to us, some pleasurable feeling if nothing else. Even if that’s just the feeling of having done a good deed, of making someone else happy, of ensuring one’s children are safe and secure. Without some good feeling for yourself, there is no motivation to act.
The kind of selfless love you talk about is of course possible–but I don’t think it is the kind of romantic love that subsists between a man and a woman (or partners of the same sex for gays and lesbians), nor the kind of love one feels for one’s family, but a kind of universal, impersonal, Platonic love for mankind in general (or sentient beings in general). There can be a “disinterested” love for, let’s say, the homeless or the sick–disinterested in the sense that you don’t know them personally, or that it doesn’t matter which homeless or sick person whose life you wish to ameliorate–but there is always a drive to do good, to show love, behind this, and that drive is that it makes us feel like we are better human beings. This is different from the objective–which is to give to the poor, help the needy and the sick, for its own sake–but we need something more in order to actually act on that objective.
This is especially true of romantic relationships. In romantic relationships, you do have that drive to put the other’s needs and desires ahead of yourself, and that does make you feel good (even romantic), but there’s also the desire that the selfless act of love you show your partner come from you. What I mean is, if I was in love with someone, and I saw another man taking care of all my lover’s needs and desires, this would mostly likely not come along with a feeling of contentment or satisfaction–as in: ah, my lover is getting all her needs and desires fulfilled–but with jealousy. We always need to remember that love–no matter what kind–is rooted in our biology. There is a biological function of romantic love: it is to form a mutually reciprocal relationship with a partner, someone with whom you can not only form an alliance, but a family. The idea is not just to ensure the safety and happiness of your partner, but to nurture a relationship in which the same is reciprocated and an environment can be built around that reciprocal relationship conducive to bearing and raising children. So the love you show has to come from you, not another man, for that is the way our biology is setup with respect to romantic love.
Gotcha! 
Of course, I know you’re a man.
Insofar as your “assumption” goes though, it’s just an assumption. It’s very possible that there is a woman out there with a personality like yours…not totally but could be mostly. But if you ever meet her, I would run.
Well, as they say, there is somebody for everybody. I find myself in wishful thinking where I would like to believe in that.
Whether that’s true or not I don’t know.
HaHaHa,
I’m sure there is somebody for everybody. Just go to a club and observe the scenery there.
Aside from which, if you really believe that, why are you in a self-imposed exile?
Animals make fine friends but they can’t really be your special “somebody” can they? Well, I suppose I might rather have a wolf as my special somebody than many who are out there - in a non-sexually intimate way that is.
Be careful what you wish for as sometimes it is only in hindsight when we come to realize that “Heh, she wasn’t my someone”. “Why didn’t I see that then?” Anyway, you’re quite safe in the wilderness unless the inhabitants get really hungry.
I’ll be hunting for my special somebody once my life is elevated and I find myself in a better position to do so…
Hopefully she’ll love me on her own independently and I won’t have to force and coerce her to…time will tell.
arc, I think a deep existential awareness of our place in the universe and the circumstances we are in is intimately involved in our comprehension of love or agape or whatever you want to call it. because at the end of the day life really is no good (you are born without being consulted first, live an average 80 years, and die at the end of it. all this for no reason), anything that is good in life is cherished that much more… which means the fact that the great people you know and love are going to die one day, is much heavier. that concealed feeling of sorrow we have when we reflect on the ephemeral insignificance of what we admire and love. and gib this is not an interested love… its purely intellectual. the love comes from the sympathy one has for something beautiful; not because I can’t have it or experience it or any other selfishly motivated reasons. the simple fact THAT something beautiful must come to an end… that is the deepest sadness.
Zooty,
If you have greatly loved/greatly love and been greatly loved, how can you say that life is really no good – at the end of the day? Because at some point it has to come to an end? Isn’t that a really pessimistic, nihilistic way to look at it? And isn’t the very fact that it has to at some point come to an end make it all the more precious and worthy of BEING and being grateful for it? The fact that “Nothing gold can stay” (Frost) gives us the impetus to focus on the having and not on the losing. That’s not to say that we’ve closed our eyes to the pain that will someday come.
Sadly, not always unless someone has the wisdom to see it.
If it is “real” admiration and love, would it ever be ephemerally insignifcant? All we can do is live in the present moment…not to do just that, we ourselves are making that human experience as insignifcant and robbing ourselves of experiencing that love when it is with us.
I’ve been there. But on the other side of that, it can also be the deepest joy that one has experienced it in the first place - I mean that something beautiful.
Would you yourself, Zooty, if you had a choice, give up the love you have now (I’m not saying you have one) in order to avoid the pain, no matter how deeply felt and agonizing it is?
The saying goes shared victories not shared losses… that’s true for a certain kind of love, what gib means when he says love is selfish. In a shared victory you are interested in the other person and probably have some investment in them. You may love the person as a means and not an end, here.
But to feel sorrow at another’s misfortune… that has nothing to do with you. Evolutionary anthropologists describe that as the altruistic behavior of an animal that has an interest in other’s genes. So then essentially when we feel this sorrow at the misfortune of another we are thinking on an instinctual level: man that’s a good set of genes… hate to see a good set of genes like that have to struggle. This is depressing. I feel sad and discouraged. Why do bad things have to happen to good genes, etc.